I am such an Old

[kathleen_dailey]

Recently I saw a post suggesting that commenting on any AO3 fic that was posted more than a week or two earlier was perceived as de trop at best and repellently creepy at worst. WTAF.

By extension, is one not meant to express an opinion about, say, The Left Hand of Darkness (published in 1969) if one reads the work for the first time in 2026? How about Christopher Marlowe? The Tale of Genji? The Gospel of Thomas? A great-grandmother's diaries? Do readers IRL never reread their favourite novels or stories from decades ago?

Specifically with respect to AO3, what is the point of a publication archive if not to introduce readers to new, middle-aged, and old works?

Sincerely asking someone who knows the reason to please explain. (Especially the "creepy" aspect.) Apologies in advance if this topic has already been discussed. It's new to me--or at least it's made an impression on me for the first time!

Comments

[the_siobhan]

From what I understand, it's derived from women finding it creepy and stalker-y when a guy goes through their instagram or FB and likes every single old picture. It spread from there to other sites, and now people have started saying it's the same thing to do that to a writer. (Meanwhile, every time the subject comes up every single writer in the vicinity yells, "NO IT'S NOT, PLEASE READ AND APPRECIATE MY OLD WORK, IT'S ABSOLUTELY WELCOME.")

It's like the "queer is a slur" kerfuffle, somebody says it, The Kids accept it at face value, and now The Olds are playing whack-a-mole every time it comes up.

[kathleen_dailey]

now people have started saying it's the same thing to do that to a writer.

Wow. So it's an example of the analogical fallacy, which you would think they'd have learned about in Modes of Reasoning 101. But maybe that class, or any introduction-to-logic class, is no longer offered at universities? (If they're even old enough to be at university.)

Thanks for explaining this--and it's good to know that writers are metaphorically whacking those sloppy-thinking moles. :)

[kitarella_imagines]

I think they are talking nonsense. AO3 is an archive. The definition of the word is the place where historical documents or records are kept. i.e. documents from the past.

But if it is just an archive there would be no way to even leave comments, so having a comment option implies strongly we are meant to leave comments on any fic we choose.

Quite a while ago I concluded that just because teenagers decide the meaning of something, it doesn't mean the rest of us have to do the same. It is often just a passing fancy of theirs anyway.

[kathleen_dailey]

I think they are talking nonsense. AO3 is an archive. The definition of the word is the place where historical documents or records are kept. i.e. documents from the past.

Quite right. And as we've discussed before, it appears that some number of users never learned what an archive is. SMH.

[mrs_leary]

Oh my, no... I have my old fic up and backdated, and I cannot tell you how delighted I am when someone likes some old piece - which to me is way past its use-by date, but to them is something fresh or at least interesting. I've uploaded a fair bit more than I am 100% comfortable with, because it is an archive after all, and I can see the progression in my work as a writer and as a human.

The only time I ended up feeling "over it" was when I had a whole lot of "This fic is older than I am! LOL!" comments... Which was funny for a while, but then got a tad tedious.

I think the_siobhan is probably correct, with the alleged creepyness originating elsewhere and misapplied here.

[kathleen_dailey]

I cannot tell you how delighted I am when someone likes some old piece

Yes, exactly. To me, that experience shows that the archive is fulfilling its intended purpose--to allow new readers to discover old works that otherwise would never been available to them.

I had a whole lot of "This fic is older than I am! LOL!" comments... Which was funny for a while, but then got a tad tedious.

I hear you. I think some of my newer readers might say not just "my mother read your stories" but "my grandmother read your stories." I'm very okay with them not telling me that to my face, though. :)

[sef1029]

I'm also an Old. (Bet you guessed.) I have several theories about this wacko approach to commenting.

1. These people are too young to have a backlog of stories/art/etc. and haven't yet realized that their work will still have value next year. (They also don't understand they'll get old, like most humans.)

2. Maybe they resent the highly praised works of yesteryear (a select group, of course) and don't want to be compared? No one's doing much reccing these days, so perhaps they don't know about the best old stuff.

3. Maybe they prefer off-the-cuff works that are immediate reactions to a show? Makes sense in some media. (Or younger folk just don't read much, as some studies have shown.)

4. They're enjoying their current fandom in whichever medium they presently use, and so they just have appetite for what's scrolling by today. That's where they can have interaction NOW. You won't get that on a twenty-year-old classic. (Well, you could, but younger folk probably aren't in those venues.)

5. I suspect a lot of this is coming from bots, for reasons unknown to me. Something to do with purity culture?

6. A lot of fans today seem to feel that only compliments are allowed in comments. (Sad to this former editor, and amusing to this longtime fan who learned early that if you don't want to get actual feedback DON'T POST IT.) If you're only commenting or receiving comments from stuff that scrolled by from your friends this week, you probably aren't in much danger of criticism. Older works and older folks may seem scary. (Well, we are. Ha.)

7. Limited or no experience with AO3 and all the fabulous works hidden therein. Many people seem to rely on tags and never delve into filters, so they don't realize how easily they could customize their experience.

[kathleen_dailey]

Excellent points, all of them. This one in particular really resonated with me (also a former editor and longtime fan):

A lot of fans today seem to feel that only compliments are allowed in comments. (Sad to this former editor, and amusing to this longtime fan who learned early that if you don't want to get actual feedback DON'T POST IT.)

Every time authors say, in essence, "We're writing our stories for free, you're only allowed to say sweet schmoopy things about them, and if we wanted concrit we'd ask for it," I want to bite them. Not sure where the idea came from that no one should ever have their tiny feelings hurt by a reader saying, "Insert a line space between paras please & thank you" or "An understanding of sequence of tenses is a good thing" or "Consider proofreading before posting." They're offering their work to the public, FFS, and the public has opinions. (May the goddess help them if they ever interact IRL with editors and agents and publishers.)

That said, as an Old with limited energy and motivation, and to avoid frustration and urges to bite, I don't post comments on anything I read that isn't immediately interesting and at least reasonably well written. I nope out of everything else.

I think I wandered off topic. Sorry.

[sef1029]

Heh. I cut out my own somewhat off-topic peeve, which is that readers are often so unadventurous. Try something different! If it's not for you, close the doc and try something else. Sure, it's OK to fit today's choice to today's mood, but does everything have to be your ship, your rating? does it always have to have a happy ending? be in your preferred POV? only so short or so long? and on and on.

(Brought to you by a mostly gen writer who believes characters ought to have lives outside their bedrooms. And, yes, they do die like all of us. Shocking.)

[senmut]

It's absolute bull hockey peddled by the same cult-minded brats in the purity culture schema, to my way of thinking. I have ONLY seen very young people espouse that view.

[kathleen_dailey]

I have ONLY seen very young people espouse that view

That's reassuring in one way--it means that the majority of readers don't hold that view. OTOH, will those cult-minded brats ever develop the most basic critical-thinking skills that will allow them to reason their way out of any given paper bag? I want to believe that they'll grow older and wiser, but who knows.

[princessofgeeks]

OMG this is so not correct.

I get comments on fic I wrote 15 years ago and am delighted to have them. And I answer them!

I think people are going back and reading my old stuff when they run across the few HR fic I have written this year!!! And that's awesome! I love it!

Who comes up with this shit.

[kathleen_dailey]

I get comments on fic I wrote 15 years ago and am delighted to have them. And I answer them!

Yes! And the idea that people are finding and reading your old stories because they love your new ones is exactly the way that fan fiction is supposed to work. (IMO, anyway.) That's how readers discover all the good stuff, and incidentally follow a favourite writer's progress and development and approach to the craft.

Plus, it takes time for a reader to discover and reflect on what she thinks about a story, and to write a comment that expresses those thoughts accurately. The instantaneous "OMG I love them they are so soft write more plz" responses (which may be what some or most writers actually want, for all I know) are like cotton candy. Fluffy, insubstantial, and gone in an instant.